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Thread: front sway bar and squeaky end links

  1. #1
    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    front sway bar and squeaky end links

    i put on some NAPA brand end links (i think they have poly bushings) the other day, as well as a sway bar from a '92 trans (was able to put a 13/16 around for a snug fit, so it's either 20mm or 21mm), but the front bar is still stock. i found a 4th gen, mid 90's firebird formula 8, but i haven't been able to find the specs on the front bar for that car. and another thing (and furthermore, and also, etc.), my car looks like it's leaning towards the passenger side. i took a measurement from the top of the rim to the center of the wheel well on both sides of the rear, and the driver side sits higher by about 1/2". to get to the point, i have four questions:


    -is there a way to reduce the amount of squeakiness from the poly bushings? or is it even coming from the sway bar end link bushings? (there was a bit of squeaking before i changed the end links and rear sway bar, but it seems louder now)

    -what is the size of the front sway bar for a mid 90s firebird formula 8?


    -do all 4th gen v8s come with limited slip differentials?


    -what could be causing my car to lean to one side? *i have bilstein shocks with only a few thousand miles, a umi PHB , new sway bar end links, and a larger rear sway bar*


    any and all help is appreciated!


    edit: i know that the upgraded suspension has a WS6 and lsd has G80 rpo code, but i didn't find an rpo sticker on the door. i think it was ripped off. could the rpo sticker be in the glove box? (90s firebird formula, LT1)
    Last edited by shaggyjake; 03-10-2014 at 09:21 PM.

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  3. #2
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    Do you have any other poly bushings in your suspension? They tend to squeak quite a bit and the only way to fully get rid of it forever is to go with rubber and not use poly. Grease helps, but it will eventually come back.

    Stock front sway bar size for a mid 90's Formula is going to be 30mm. 3rd gen IROC/GTA will have either a 34mm solid bar or a 36mm hallow bar on the front. I think the 4th gen WS6/SS will have a solid 32mm bar on the front.

    Yes, all 4th gen V8s came with the limited slip.

    Try switching your wallet from your back pocket to your front pocket. That should help. Sagging springs can also cause the lean, if they are factory originals it is entirely feasible they have started to sag.

  4. #3
    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats13 View Post
    Do you have any other poly bushings in your suspension? They tend to squeak quite a bit and the only way to fully get rid of it forever is to go with rubber and not use poly. Grease helps, but it will eventually come back.

    Stock front sway bar size for a mid 90's Formula is going to be 30mm. 3rd gen IROC/GTA will have either a 34mm solid bar or a 36mm hallow bar on the front. I think the 4th gen WS6/SS will have a solid 32mm bar on the front.

    Yes, all 4th gen V8s came with the limited slip.

    Try switching your wallet from your back pocket to your front pocket. That should help. Sagging springs can also cause the lean, if they are factory originals it is entirely feasible they have started to sag.
    -the end links are the only poly bushings, and they only squeak over speed bumps and the like, but cornering wise they feel pretty good. i'll try some more grease on 'em.

    -thank you for that info on the sway bars, that is the kind of quality stuff i was looking for! where, perchance, did you acquire this info?

    -any tips for swappin' out my open diff for an lsd?

    -i doesn't feel like it's leaning when i'm in it, i can literally see it leaning to one side. i'll upload a couple pics ina bit.

    thanks for all the help MinnesotaFats! super helpful!

  5. #4
    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    I'm headed to the scrapyard again this weekend for the front sway bar, LSD, and possibly the springs off of the formula8 there.

    Here is a pic of the rear; te passenger side definitely sags
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    loosen up your endlinks they are out of place and are probably too tight. they need to be just tight enough to in place but not mushrooming. for the lsd its easier to just swap the whole axle out if your not confident in your alignment specs of the spur gear and bearing preload.

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    (╯□)╯︵ /(.□ . \) Sparky's Avatar
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    FYI, the passenger side almost always sits lower on these cars than the driver side, although that does look like a little bit more difference than usual.
    - Jared
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    I have been ingrained in f-bodies for lots of years and just picked it up and never forgot. If you search Google, I am sure you will be able to find everything you are looking for. I know with the 3rd gens, since that is what I own and really know, there were somewhere in the neighborhood of 10 front/rear sway bar combinations. If you visit www.thirdgen.org you will be able to find them all in the tech section, off the main page, I think.

    Also, I have to agree with madforce10 on the end links and the rearend. I didn't think about them being too tight. To make life easy I would just swap the entire rear over. Brakes are the same, width is the same, and you will not have to worry about taking things apart.

    One thing on the springs, the V8 springs will have a higher spring rate which in turn will make the car sit a little higher. A quick fix, that some will not agree with, is to cut a half of a coil or a full coil off. The major issue with that is it changes the spring rate and a lot of times you will not be able to get the car to sit completely level.

    Glad I could help.

  9. #8
    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by madforce10 View Post
    loosen up your endlinks they are out of place and are probably too tight. they need to be just tight enough to in place but not mushrooming. for the lsd its easier to just swap the whole axle out if your not confident in your alignment specs of the spur gear and bearing preload.

    Is this what's causing te squeaking? I tightened the end links on a lift, and I tightened each one until it would go any tighter, but the squeaking is only coming from one end link, the passenger rear. I'll get some pics up later, but none of the bushings are mushrooming from what I can remember.

    Should I get springs off another v6 from the scrapyard instead of the formula?

    What happens if I just switch out the rear springs from the formula 8?

  10. #9
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    Rear springs should not matter. The weight of the rear is the same from car to car. The problem you will run into is the V8 weights more, so they increase the rate. If you get the springs from another V6 it will be just fine. That is, of course, if the springs are still tight on each car. If they have worn out, they will sag as well. Depending on how much time and money you have, you could always pick up both and see which one you like the best.

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    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    What's y'all's personal opinions on proper grease for polyurethane bushings?
    Rubber?

    -I've never removed rear springs on an f body, but if I remember from what I've read you just drop the rear axle and the springs will come right out?

  12. #11
    Full Throttle SlasherVRGR's Avatar
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    If it's and ls car they only weigh > 100lbs more if I remember right, you're going from an all iron v6 to an all aluminum v8 so the weight difference is very minute. Idk why bit I'm pretty sure they still have higher rate springs than the v6. 98+ cars have smaller bars and stiffer springs, 97- cars have softer springs and bigger bars. All the v8 cars in the 4th gen have different spring rates than the v6 cars in the front and the rear. I would imagine their logic is sound. With more power and torque comes more squat, so they up the spring rate.

    Sent from my ADR6300 using Tapatalk

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    5spd, Slp lid, Free ram air, Pacesetters, !egr, Slowmaster Cat-back, Founders Lcas, Founders relo brackets, 32mm front sway bar, 19mm rear sway bar, poly trans mount..
    Much nicer, better, cleaner, and most importantly faster than the old one

  13. #12
    Full Throttle SlasherVRGR's Avatar
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    As for grease everyone seems to recommend silicone grease for poly.

    Edit:

    The springs just come out when you drop the rear.

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    Last edited by SlasherVRGR; 03-13-2014 at 08:26 PM.

    98 Maro
    5spd, Slp lid, Free ram air, Pacesetters, !egr, Slowmaster Cat-back, Founders Lcas, Founders relo brackets, 32mm front sway bar, 19mm rear sway bar, poly trans mount..
    Much nicer, better, cleaner, and most importantly faster than the old one

  14. #13
    Newbie shaggyjake's Avatar
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    Unhappy

    According to this(from a sticky in This forum[which I should have read first]) the rear spring rates are the same for both v6 and v8, the only difference being the SS models, which came with two SLP options (that I can't find anywhere. Discontinued?) but if I can find a decent junker with low miles then I would be willing to gamble a few bucks on some springs. It's too bad about about the slp springs though, decent spring rates for both front and rear and a perfectly mild drop in ride height. I would roll with some strano springs or even hotchkiss/eibach but i don't have adjustable shocks (I'm runnin on bilstein hd).



    I was asking about the grease because I have seen dozens and dozens of threads on various forums about what is the right grease for poly bushings, and there are too many different responses. I was curious to know what you guys thought (although, to be on the safe side I'm just gonna run with white lithium which was recommended per the instructions that came with the napa poly bushings.)

    I'll post an update and some pics this Saturday when I can get some shop time in.
    I'm gonna wait on the diff, but goin ahead with rear springs and front sway bar from a formula 8
    Attached Images Attached Images

  15. #14
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    I picked up sway bars from a 00+ ws6. (32mm front and 19mm) rear. And then bought poly bushings and endlinks from summit. Believe they were energy suspension brand. What an upgrade, car handles great now. They came with grease, I believe it was lithium but not 100% sure, it lists it on the site if you wanna take a look.

    Did you tighten the end links with the suspension loaded or unloaded? Idk if you specified. But I do believe the car is supposed to be sitting under its own weight when tightening them up. A few people I know also have their cars lean to the passenger side, some say its so the car is level when the driver is in it. Some just saw tough luck. people have swapped in new springs, shocks, and shock mounts to no avail. In your case you have stock springs so don't jump to conclusions. But if new springs don't fix it, you can do the heater hose mod to just the driver side in hopes of it leveling out.

    Also, I would advice against grabbing springs from the mid 90s formula. If its over 100k miles, which I'm sure it is, probably a lot more. Then it has just as beat up springs as yours or worse. You can get stock replacements for pretty cheap. Or even upgrade to performance/ lowering springs for a good price. (Just bought brand new in box BMR springs and BMR adj pan hard bar locally for $275)

  16. #15
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    strano springs and bilstien shocks are not a bad combo the springs just slightly over power the shocks but i have seen cars handle well with that setup. im running koni yellows with strano springs sways and a watts link. im actually looking right now to bump up in spring rate in the rear ( since i just gots the watts link and im still tuning it in). with a panhard bar with 150 rear spring rate was right on.

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