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Thread: Lowering PHB

  1. #1
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    Lowering PHB

    I was doing some reading on tech about Watts Linkages and read where a guy lowered his PHB and said he got good results and claimed that no difference could be felt between a Watts and a lowered PHB. He referred everyone over to frrax.com, where I read their chasis/susp tech and they talked about it as well. Has anyone ever looked at this? I cant seem to find any "lowering brackets" anywhere, though.
    1997 Camaro - sold
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  3. #2
    Squirt Director Seppo's Avatar
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    "The advantage of the Panhard rod is its simplicity. Its major disadvantage is that the axle must necessarily move in an arc relative to the body, with the radius equal to the length of the Panhard rod. If the rod is too short, there will be excessive sideways movement between the axle and the body at the ends of the spring travel."

    Changing the mounting location/angles/length basically changes the arc that the rear end moves with vertically, right?

    While he felt no difference, I bet physically there is a difference. And I would bet you could monkey with the PHB so there was no practical advantage of switching to watts.

    But I feel like I have seen PHB reloc brackets.... BMR, UMI, Spohn, or someone used to sell them.
    Keith
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  4. #3
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    I see now, I thought all of the PHB relocation kits were just for the upper support, I didnt realize it also lowers the PHB itself. But at $209 I think I could make 2 brackets that would work just as well for cheaper. From what Ive read the upper support doesnt do a whole hellovalot.

    1997 Camaro - sold
    2013 WRX - the awd DD

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    ┬─┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ) triple_l82's Avatar
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    no, most people remove the upper support for weight redux in drag racing. Some even go the length to box in the PHB bracket attached to the frame with just enough open to allow the actual bar to still travel freely. Id just get an adjustable bar, box in the bracket and remove the upper brace. call it a day.
    Larry:
    1996 camaro- Ole Blue. the very very very long time consuming project car
    1997 camaro- VIPER- turbov6camaro, search the forum for more info
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    I have an adjustable PHB. And I autox my car, no drag race. lol. And from what Tpunk told me boxing the support bar does pretty much nothing.
    1997 Camaro - sold
    2013 WRX - the awd DD

  7. #6
    ┬─┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ) triple_l82's Avatar
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    hmm, he knows his stuff on suspension to so I would beleive it. Its just something I have seen done.
    Larry:
    1996 camaro- Ole Blue. the very very very long time consuming project car
    1997 camaro- VIPER- turbov6camaro, search the forum for more info
    1979 Mustang Cobra - dad passed and left it to me, gonna be a clean street/strip car
    2014 Silverado CCSB 4x4 LTZ diamond white. Daily driver

  8. #7
    emertxE elttorhT lluF
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    And from what Tpunk told me boxing the support bar does pretty much nothing.
    Is that the support bar above the phb? I've always wanted to get rid of it, looks heavy. Just never was sure it did anything.
    2009 Civic SI
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  9. #8
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    Yeah, thats it. Im not sure they are incredibly heavy, the stock PHB isnt that heavy, and it looks exactly the same.
    1997 Camaro - sold
    2013 WRX - the awd DD

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    ┬─┬ ノ( ゜-゜ノ) triple_l82's Avatar
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    Oh I miss read that whole thing. I was talking about the bracket not top bar. THe bracket to which the panhard bar is bolted to not the top brace. I've seen guys box the bracket to keep it from flexing when They would remove the top bar.
    Larry:
    1996 camaro- Ole Blue. the very very very long time consuming project car
    1997 camaro- VIPER- turbov6camaro, search the forum for more info
    1979 Mustang Cobra - dad passed and left it to me, gonna be a clean street/strip car
    2014 Silverado CCSB 4x4 LTZ diamond white. Daily driver

  11. #10
    Beer Connoisseur Tpunk's Avatar
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    Boxing the bracket does help but isn't as good as having the bace. The PHB lowering kit that most of the guys on frrax use to use was from unbalanced engineering. Lowering the the phb lowers your roll center. When you do that you change A LOT in the geometry. Doing this will require you to run either stiffer springs or a larger rear sway bar. After doing all this the car will feel completely different but not always better. It in no way is the same as swapping to a watts linkage. Granted the watts linkage sold for our cars has an ajustable height to change the roll center but that is the only similarity. A watts linkage stays centered throughout the suspension travel. Also because of its design turning left and right are identical. With the PHB turning one direction will generally be better than the other because of the arc movement of the linkage. When all is said and done I wouldn't lower either one for street duty.
    John, 1999 Isuzu Vehicross Ironman Edition
    No more F-Bodies after 15 years of nothing else

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